NEW GREEK BAILOUT IS BAD DEAL FOR TAX PAYERS, SAY GERMAN ECONOMISTS


*Greece defaults but default arranged in such a way that tax payers will pay more

*All of the 109-billion euro new Greek bailout will go for financing Greek debt until 2014

*ESF to be able to buy debt on secondary market and issue bonds; transfer union cemented

*Key issues of Greek insolvency and lack of competitiveness not addressed

*Outright EU fiscal union and eurobonds avoided due to pressure from German parliament and electorate

*Eurozone continues on unsustainable trajectory of debt, low growth; next crisis preprogrammed

Thursday’s eurozone summit was hyped as a make or break moment for single currency bloc. But if the aim was to provide ease for eurozone tax payers, who are seeing an ever greater proportion of their taxes being transferred to an elite under the pretext of having to pay interest payments on fractional-reserve bank debt, it largely failed.

Clearly worried that the German parliament and electorates will rebell, the elite have pulled back from the brink of a creating an outright fiscal union and seem to be resorting, instead, to an ever more elaborate and subtle system of smoke and mirrors to pursue the same objetive — looting tax payers – albeit a little less aggressively, thereby allowing the eurozone to limp along a little longer as it is sucked deeper into a debt death spiral.

German economist Hans-Werner Sinn swept aside the hype and today strongly criticised the new Greek bailout package “as bad news for tax payers”, according to The Telegraph.

“Germany and France should not make policies that lead to the collectivisation of debts in Europe.

The financial markets are reacting very positively to yesterday’s agreements. As this is a conflict of apportionment between Europe’s tax payers and investors, this is bad news for tax payer,” Sinn said in an interview with Reuters TV.

“The socialisation of losses goes on  as merrily as before: the extra money which is being given to the Greeks virtually as a present will never been seen again,“  Sinn told Die Welt.

Reiner Holznagel, vice president of Germany’s League of Taxpayers, also criticised the new eurozone bailout deal.

“There has to be improvement in this respect so that taxpayers aren’t constantly faced with new liability risks,. The EU decision that the bailout fund in the future can buy debt of states in crisis by itself seals the transformation into a liability union,” he said.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/8654064/Eurozone-debt-crisis-plan-live.html

http://www.handelsblatt.com/politik/deutschland/steuerzahlerbund-wettert-gegen-griechenland-zusagen/4421612.html

True, a precedent was set: a eurozone country was allowed to default on their debt. But Greece’s default was arranged in such a way that it will actually cost tax payers more money.

Greece is to get a new bail out of €109 billion – and all of this will end up in the pockets of the banks.  

According to Austrian media, 88 billion will be used for refinancing Greek souvereign debt until 2014.  Greece is set to spend 30 billion euros plus every year until 2015 on debt refinancing; in 2015 , a staggering  75 billion euros will be required by Greece to pay the interest.

Where is the much vaunted involvement of the private sector when interest payments of virtually the same size are to continue to be made under the new second Greek bailout as were planned under the first Greek bailout?

True, the Brussels summit on Thursday saw plans for the introduction of eurobonds dropped. But the transfer union was introduced by another door.

The 440 billion eurozone bailout fund, the ESF, is to be transformed into a new European-style Monetary Fund, able to intervene on the secondary market to buy the debt of insolvent governments and able to issue its on bonds, which all eurozone countries are liable for.

Indeed, 20 billion of the new Greek bailout fund of 109 billion euros will be used to buy Greek souvereign bonds  from banks.

Banks will get 50% of the nominal value for bonds. Because the banks borrowed money from the ECB to buy the bonds, they are making a huge profit. This measure appears to aim at recapitalising insolvent banks.

There is no sign that eurozone leaders are ready to address the fundamental problems created by so many insolvent banks – and by a financial system based fractional reserve banking and money creation as debt. There seem to be just more creative ways of funnelling money to the banks to hoodwink angry citizens.

In spite of the hype, the eurozone summit also failed to address the key issue of the insolvency of Greece.

True, interest rates for Greece, Ireland and Portugal are to be reduced from about 6% to 3.5% and maturities on Greece’s debt are to be extended from the current 7.5 years to somewhere between 15 years and 30 years, a welcome move.

But what use is such a reduction if the countries still cannot return to the markets to finance their own debt and so will depend on transfers indefinitely? What was needed was a substantial haircut of Greek debt by two thirds or so to 60% of GDP not an overall reduction of only about a quarter.

Ireland is to to pay 800 million less in interest rates a year under the new deal but budget cuts of 3.6 billion are being planned in December , and the people of Ireland will continue to see their wealth transferred to foreign creditors while domestic demand is crushed.

A strong export sector may see Ireland able eventually to servicve its debt at lower interest rates – but why should all the current account surpluses Ireland generates go to pay foreign creditors even if Ireland manages this unlikely feat?

There is virtually zero prospect of Greece ever being able to service ist staggering mountain of debt no matter how low the interest rate is.

Handicapped by corrupt government elite working hand in hand with a complicit EU elite, it is not clear whether how much or any of the EU funds to be mobilised for a “a comprehensive strategy for growth and investment“ for Greece will end up diverted into offshore bank accounts.

No measures to address the fundamental problems of the eurozone countries sinking under a mountain of fractional reserve banking debt have been introduced. There are no plans to allow countries like Greece to regain competitiveness and generate more income by introducing the Drachma.

The new package does little to stop the transfer of wealth from eurozone taxpayers to an elite under the pretext of having to pay interest on fractional reserve debts. It just creates new mechanisms for doing so at a somewhat slower pace.

Terrified of angry citizens, the EU elite have not dared to embark on full scale fiscal union and eurobonds. They have not dared to continue with their flagrant looting of tax payers as before with penal interest rates, crushing economies. They have been forced to make some concessions to tax payers, such as introducing the possibility of a default for an indebted country.

But a closer look at the new Greek bailout shows that behind all the smoke and mirrors, tax payers will see only a little less of their money being transferred to banks as interest payments on debt.

We need real defaults, real haircuts for bondholders and real mechanisms for dealing with insolvent and uncompetitive countries – DM or Drachma? — that lead to a unambiguous and verifiable reduction in the amount of tax money going to banks in the eurozone.

In the long term, the entire financial system based on debt has to be overhauled.

The results of the summit — a default by Greece and lower interest rates — offer a glimmer of hope that continuing pressure by citizens will bring about meaningful action to reduce the debt burden on the eurozone.

87 Responses to NEW GREEK BAILOUT IS BAD DEAL FOR TAX PAYERS, SAY GERMAN ECONOMISTS

  1. Carlitos Amsel vom Holunderstrauch says:

    How can they keep on doing this? Do we have so little intelligent people in our countyies, that it is not openly seen what is going on? And in any case, as soon as the political climate is right, the Banksters will be back with their fiscal union. We have seen it all to often. These Gangsters never give up a aimed at goal. If one wants to be rid of them, one has to crush them like cockroaches. Not crushed for good, they will keep on coming back and keep on coming back until all their surrounding has been sucked dry completely.

  2. darkside says:

    People need to stop paying for living through a permanent standing order which puts filled purses into the hands of anonymous institutions.
    Taxes are paid for services rendered.

    20% ‘Value Added Tax’ is already charged on every single item bought.
    Over 50% is tax on every liter of petrol.
    If you want to fix your house roof, you have to pay the builder’s income tax plus your own.

    Still no money left over for educations and medical facilities?

    What tax-payers should demand from governments when they hand in their annual income tax forms to the Inland Revenue is an annually renewable contract.

    Time to give up being citizens and become customers.

    The Declaration of Human Rights states that an individual has freedom of religion and belief. We also have rights as consumers to return non functioning products and sue over unfulfilled bargains.

    In theory a person does not have to do things that go against what they believe in such as buy unwanted services such as a mercenary army.

    If people do not assert their rights they do not have any. Simple as that.

  3. greenberry says:

    Very well said.
    The governments have hardly abused their confidence and should therefore be put aside and charged for abused office. Also the corrupted courts must be thorn down and replaced so we can get to real justice on the planet. As it is now the courts only running the business for the ones with money and power.

  4. Carlitos Amsel vom Holunderstrauch says:

    Yea, its madness. They are robbing us blind. They are introducing new taxes in such a pace, that most people have forgotten the last taxraise and how much they pay allready, in order not to aruse to much resistence.

    The amount of taxes we pay already, is in no relation to services we get and want. What we get, we dont want. We finance the chains we are bound with.

    We finance the mystery schools to construct systems for our destruction. We finance our own demise.

    What we need is a big Tax strike, but how, since taxes are hidden in everything? We have to turn our backs to the whole system, but if not enough people do it, they will be plugged of and hanged. If they are enough, they will be infiltrated and undermind by secret services in order to turn them into a tool against their own kind. You see, no matter which way one turns, there is no way out…-

    The only way out is to wait until the monstrocity has taken its course and everything lies in ruins and ashes. Then one can begin again, watchfull not to repeat the same mistakes and first of all, to hang every surviving member of mystery schools and a secret societies.

  5. greenberry says:

    I might even give to Ceasar what belongs to him and myself to the Creator. That is my human right and my own free and fair decision.
    It was never intended that courts and governments were made and set up for abusing the poor and sick. I have a personal feeling they are gonna have to pay for this treading. You see there is a Higher Court than those earthly ones.

  6. greenberry says:

    Not about the article but just had a phone call about this matter:
    http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2011/0722/Oslo-bombing-puts-Norway-on-edge-VIDEO

  7. greenberry says:

    Sarkoszy again comming up with a fast
    conclusion. Reminds me about the Strauss-Kahn
    incident when authorities knew what had happened even before it happened.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14254705

  8. Carlitos Amsel vom Holunderstrauch says:

    I know. I have checked it already and sent you some mails about it. Smells a bit like Gladio, but to early to say. Here is the usual blabla freemasonry stuff in German, for late comers:

  9. greenberry says:

    Paul Joseph Watson rising some very interesting and important questions that should be considered in this article about the bombing.
    http://www.prisonplanet.com/oslo-terror-whose-agenda-does-it-serve.html

  10. greenberry says:

    And as always staged events are accompanied with security drills around it.
    What a coincidence. A bomb sweep the day before. And closed roads for underground sewage works the days before etc. etc. Underground explosion bomb pattern but trying to make it look like coming from a car (or an airplane demolishing a whole building) flashing some deja vu. Havent I seen this before somewhere. It was even a twin incident connected. Like the twin towers. And this time some white Al-CIAida instead of the usual brown and black. To make it more believeable this colour variation used hoping to fool us one more time.
    Anyway I am not going to fall for it. It is the same guys behind this as always before. No doubt.

  11. greenberry says:

    I smell a rotten stench of Bilderberg-CIA staged incident. Correct me if I am wrong.

  12. According to first messages, it was done by one ethnic Norwegian, who planted the bomb in Oslo and then drove to a camping resort where youngsters from the ruling party where staying. Dressed like a cop, he gathered the kids to supposedly tell them about the bombing in Oslo, and shot them. We will see, what will be made of it during the coming days…. One thing seems to be true: He did not like the ruling aprty…-

  13. greenberry says:

    Somehow Carlitos I am curious about your GLADIO suspicion so close to the time of the incident. This GLADIO is also mentioned here in this clip.
    http://www.youtube.com/user/TheAlexJonesChannel#p/u/3/q91ky_lQTFk
    And in the same reports Bob Chapman mentioning the incident can have something to do what happening in Greece.
    Therefore I might have been wrong when writing in a comment above the bombing has nothing to do with this article.

  14. GLADIO, the NATO underground army, is traditionally the tool to bring states population on line. I have heard that Norway had pulled back of the child murdering NATO crimes in Lybia. That could be one reason, making the public aware of the “real” danger of terrorism to get their consent for some harsh measures. But what disturbes me in this picture is the fact that they caught a guy. They have a crime suspect in custody, dont they? And thats strange, since GLADIO operations never leave anybody behind. But, of course, they might have set somebody up as a fall guy. On the other hand, why the need for a fall guy? They could have just done the deed and disapear, as they usually do. Maybe time will tell. In the end it turns out, the guy was angry because the ruling party had cut his pension, so he went of, bombed their building and shot some of the parties upcoming generation?

  15. greenberry says:

    Well I am so amazed by the stupidity of such terrorists. They know how to kill innocent people but the real criminals are like this Mcafee. Never around to die or get injured by the attacks. It is always so perfectly timed.
    Always running out the backdoor when the attack is coming. Like that Churchill never were around when Hitler attacked.
    What I mean if there were real terrorists involved they would had done a much better work in getting to the guys they were angry at. Not only innocent youngsters and people?

  16. darkside says:

    Do not forget Timothy McVeigh.
    Do not forget Thomas Hamilton of Dunblane, Scotland..
    Never forget the many ‘run amok gunmen’ , the ‘lone madmen’ of Finland, Germany, and the American university campuses.

    Now Norway.
    It’s another terror incitement incident to bewilder, distract and coerce.

    Keep focused on the bankers’ takeover.
    Solidarity with Iceland.
    There is a press blackout of information on the strong and lawful resistance presently going on in Iceland.

    Solidarity with the inhabitants f Greece.
    Solidarity with the inhabitants of the Irish Republic.
    The thieves have come for our neighbors’ goods.
    Shall we wait till they come for us?

    However caution and wisdom is called for in any act.
    One has to bear in mind that any form of organization runs the danger or being hijacked and of paving the way, creating an infra-structure and giving an excuse for a one world government and eventually a world dictatorship.

    A resistance can not unite as a group under a ‘leadership’ – those days are gone.
    What remains is the chaotic mass of sovereign individuals who can act with intelligence, non violence, tolerance and dignity.

    All strength to You.

  17. greenberry says:

    Of course they are REAL terrorists pretending to attack themselves to get to this states population on line solution. They have all kinds of knowledge about mind controlling and setting up some sacrifice like this uniformed policeman. And they have the MONEY to make it happen.

  18. Nice speach.
    I’ve heard a lot in my life, but I’ve seen very little of it materialize. If anyone out of a opposing, refusing crowd ever opposed and refused what he believed in to be worth opposing and refusing, it was me. Thats why I found myself in prison eventually, and none of the opposing and refusing crowd ever sent me a pack of tobaco…-

    Their media blackouts are in vain pretty much, since more and more people tend to get their information out of alternative news sources. I am still curious as hell, why did they catch the guy? Why was he in police uniform? He did not have to be, for the job he has done. Was it originally for his get away and something went wrong? Was he not planned to be caught? It was in no way a one man action. There must have been organisation behind it And where does one get a bomb from? I could’nt get one if I wanted one. I have seen fotos that showed, the explosion was not a very big one. It did not cause damage worth mentioning to buildings. It mainly blew out the windows. My grandad could have accomplished that with one of his farts.

    So it was a “Car bomb” they say? How much explosive does one get into the trunk of a car? Not much, I would think. So, for the damage done, it could have been military grade explosive, or would a car trunk full of fertilzer cause the damage we see? http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2011/jul/22/norway#/?picture=377185982&index=13 No, I would’nt think so. No way was that done by a car trunk full of fertilizer.

  19. greenberry says:

    The car was there to get the blame for the explosions so that masses would believe it was a one man job. It was set up this way to make it all look like this. Only to get all attention away from those who were behind and planned it. Thats all I guess. Like 5 men in
    an airplane connected to some Bin Ladin were to blame for the 9/11. It worked well since many fell in that main stream media tale. And the attention from the real criminals behind were drawn away.
    I was looking into something called MK-ULTRA.
    It has to do with mind control. Could this guy have been exposed to it? Only speculations but it sure would clear the picture a lot.

  20. greenberry says:

    And it was the safest to catch the guy so they can get him under control. I bet he would be interrogated only by special people
    who are themselves involved. No news or anything will come out in public more than some lie which will fit their interests perfectly. They can of course say anything about what this guy has revealed whenever they want. And I am sure it wont be the truth.

  21. What you are saying is, it was more then one bomb and they just call it a “car bomb” to divert attention away from that fact? Judging on the wide spread damage, that could well be correct. But then, they must have explodet them synchronically, which, technically, would not be a problem. News media sais, the man they caught shooting the youngsters has “Connenctions to right wing extremists”, which would, if true, point towards GLADIO, since most of them are right wing extremists. All in all there is astonishingly little information out by now. It has been more then 24 hours since it all happend, and we have heard damn little about it…-

  22. greenberry says:

    I think the uniform was there to fool the youngsters to gather by wearing authority disguise.
    A wolf in sheep cloth. Sheep wont gather so easily otherwise and the attack would be less efficient.
    I do not think it had anything to do with his escape since he probably was already under mind control. Maybe even under drugs influence.
    And why did never Mr. Stoltenberg (a former Bilderberg visitor) show up? He was sheduled to be there at Utoya and he was not in the government building bombed either. For som reason Mcaffee wasnt present this time. He never is. Only before and after.

  23. greenberry says:

    And when showing up after his speech was made as it had been prepared or worked on for weeks.

  24. The shooter killed over eighty people. He was a trained marksman, no doubt about it. Would you or me hit and kill over eighty moving targets?

  25. There is now talk of more bombs being involved, some of which have not worked and have been found. There is nor more mentioning of a “Car bomb”. It has only been mentioned right at the beginning. Why would they have mentioned a car bomb in the first place, considering the devastation. Now, it looks more like a thorough planned and executed operation, done by experts. The weird handeling of the news, the confused reporting, points towards desperate attempts to control the information outlet.

  26. greenberry says:

    I have never tried so I dont know but I am curios to know why a terrorist always hit innocent people and not the ones they are angry on and should be their logic target.
    That doesnt make much sense if the story is true. If the story is not true. Yes it will make perfectly sense.

  27. greenberry says:

    Yes the picture starting to clear. But it was the same thing with the underwear bomber. I think they changed the official story 5 times when they saw the original story did not fit.
    And now they talking about 92 victims in Norway. Just heard the news.

  28. Emanuel van den Bemd says:

    This man seems to be a curious mix of appearent good and evil, left and right, pro and anti christian and moslim.at the same time Globalist and freedon seeker , Masonic interests and what have you, very confused and sick and emonic in the mind.!!!! Does that remind anyone of what the is happening everywhere with the propaganda, the lies, the misinfo, the chaos, the intolerance, the political intrigue,the wars, HAARP,Chem trails, printing money like some crazed printing press. How does one make sense out of it all.? Read revelations and you may get some idea of what we are facing , things could get nasty very quickly, and we won’t be able to do anything about it because Satan is allowed to be at the helm and many people are allowing the demons to posses them and give those spirits complete freedom to terrorise and reign without any unobstruction.. .

  29. greenberry says:

    Yes Emanuel,
    Reading that prophecy gives a good blueprint
    on what is happening in this present time.
    It is not so dangerous prophesising about things that will happen in a long term view as it falls outside one mans life time and the ultimate punishment which is death already occured. Therefore it wouldnt be so dangerous to the prophet if it failed and was false later on. And many would try it without risk. Since they already be gone and dead at the time of fullfillment.
    But it is different with revelations and John. Cause the fullfillment happened already
    in his lifetime. Which was the short term testing of its truth. Check it up historically and find out it really also did happen. If it had not he would had been executed at the spot. That makes the long term vision valid. Cause a prophesy always have a short and long term fullfillment. If it comes from the Creator and when it is true.

  30. Your statement is very realistic, thanks for sharing, I learned so much

  31. Thats how you recognize state sponsored terrorism. Its always out to cause the greatest impact within a population, so it mainly aimes at innocent people, women, children, and the elderly, like poor ol us. (Student in his twenties…)

  32. Current events fit this prophecy so well or the other way around, because there are rich and powerfull people who in secrecy mold current events to fit the prophecy.

  33. From where we are at the moment, I feel its safe to say. It was a well planned military operation with multiple explosive devices, probably hidden inside the buildings, since the windows look as if they’d popped out and not in and there was thick black smoke coming out of some of them. The man on the island shooting kids was not alone.

    1.) the entire political class of Norway has been targeted by wrecking their buildings, plus the enire Norwegian population

    2.) by shooting its youngsters, the ruling party was especially targeted

    3.) the norwegian population was also targeted, by shooting the youngsters

    It looks like a punitive action towards the ruling party and the norwegian people for either supporting something they should’nt, or not supporting something they should.

    There clearly is no outlandish terrorist group involved, nor a inlandish political opposition. It is a clear cut case of Terrorism by the hidden hand of those, who also were behind 9.11., 07. 07., the madrid Bombing, etc. etc. Its safe to say they used the GLADIO network as mechanics.

  34. greenberry says:

    The Norway guy had made a big document that supposedely had cost him some 500000 dollars and in it he is for example explaining how to make bombs and explosives with fertilizers. By using the disguise of planting vegetables. So now there will probably come more rules and laws on food. Because of the terrorist risk. These are the things they now talking about in mainstream.
    It is seemingly coming as a shock for the authorities it is possible to do this out of fertilizers since they now suddenly exposing and ventilating this fact all over. Attention, panic…..

  35. greenberry says:

    The discussion is completely ridiculous since that have been known for 1000 of years and has not changed because of some madmen trying to prove it. Even a fart may be explosive and
    we will probably have restrictions on issuing such too.

  36. greenberry says:

    But not so much is said and discussed about the legitime weapon and war producers. Handing out it all out in a lawful and profitable way. The cause of killing million and millions of innocent people all around the world.

  37. There is NO way the devastation present was caused by fertilizer. NO WAY. There is also no way, one person could have shot all these youngster.

    I believe I know, why this fall guy was necessary. If there would have been nobody caught and blamed for it all, the suspicion would have gone towards the hidden hand of the real criminals, whos existence is pretty widely known by now, thanks to the internet. They could not have blamed it on Al Queda either, because by now it is widely known, that they work for them. So, if there would not be a fall guy caught and being blamed for everything, it would have given a back clash towards the real perpetrators.

  38. greenberry says:

    The hypocrisy is so disgusting it is not even possible to express it in words.

  39. greenberry says:

    Yes,
    The roads around the building were closed some days before the incident and that is probably the time when the real criminals planted the bomb. And the car was only there to bring attention away from this fact. How coincidental there was a bomb sweep the days before too.

  40. greenberry says:

    The fall guy did not even have a clue he was
    playing them right into their hands. He was probably mind controlled and helped to fullfill his mission perfectly. He never had a clue as those puppets never have. Someone to put the blame on as puppets always are.

  41. greenberry says:

    Although there are still many things unfolding I think this clip is safe to have a look at. It makes a seemingly complex matter to be simple without making it less thrustworthy.
    http://www.youtube.com/user/TheAlexJonesChannel#p/a/u/1/kQdBjix5NBE

  42. The Oslo bombing is being used to suggest to the people, there is a threat from “Rights WIng Extremists”. But Rightwing Extremists are those who oppose the EU superstate and rather stick to their nation state. It is also being said, the bombing highlights the existence of rightwing paramilitary groups, which will tighten the screws on everybody opposing the EU power grab.

  43. The guy is a mason. The German version of this video was supposedly quickly deleted, but here is the english one. Look:

  44. How do we know for sure that the massakre on the Island realy happend and was not only reported by TV?? Have we seen any griefing parents throwing themselfs over the casket of their murdered child? Have we seen or heard about any funeral arrangements being made? Are there death announcements being placed by parents into the various regional newspapers? Have we heard or seen ANYTHING about the shooting on the island, else then TV pictures?

  45. If there realy was a high ranking politian being expected on the island, there must have been armed security people present. Where were they? What did they do during the massacre? Participate? Lets see wheter we ever hear anything about a forensic research being conducted or whether they cremated the “bodys” and threw the ashes into the sea…. :)

  46. greenberry says:

    I have some relatives from there and last night I called and it was said by them 5 youngsters from their little small village were there. One was shoot in the leg and the four others were not injured. It is real as far as I know.

  47. greenberry says:

    I read somewhere that it was not officially knewn that Stoltenberg planned to visit the island. That this was only knewn by himself and some few others around.

  48. greenberry says:

    That this was thought to be a surprise to the youngsters. Isnt that something. Yes a surprise surely happened.

  49. greenberry says:

    And Stoltenberg is a Bilderberg attendee and therefore have connections to the danish Anders Fogh Rasmussen NATO general secretery and swedish foreign
    minister Carl Bildt. They are all members of the same
    little secret group. The Bilderberg group. And they speaking the same language and understand each other so to say. Without having to use english or othere means.

  50. greenberry says:

    Go back and look into the comments and see that I have suggested they all be put behind bars for treason long time ago. Even before this happened but there is a total blackout
    on their businesses in media and attendees at Bilderberg. Therefore no one simply not knowing what they are up to naturally.

  51. It does not matter whether it was a secret. I doubt that he would go anywhere without armed security people being present. They must have put up shop on the Island. But where were they? What did they do? Go on a hunt for kiddys?

    There are witnesses reporting, there were more shooters then only one, and the amount of dead, if the number is correct, surely speaks for that. Imagine, you start shooting into a crowd of teenagers. First thing they do is, the’d run away in every direction as fast and as far as they could and hide, or dive into the water an swim for it. How does a single Guy manage to kill more then eighty of these quick moving, lively creatures?

    The explosion damage was no way caused by a single fertilizer bomb. It looks like many small devices had been planted inside the building. There is no real structural damage worth mentioning and the windows were blown out not in, also, most debris on the street is from inside of the building.

    It was a fanfare to signal the hunt on everybody opposing the EU power grab on nation states. Everybody, who steps in for the further existence of nation states will soon be called a Nazi, a Right wing Extremeist.

    The fact that the caught Guy was a mason is being pulled out of the net. I wonder, how long the above video will work.

  52. greenberry says:

    So you noticed that little detail about the windows too. Yes I was thinking about that too
    yesterday as something very strange. Like the free fall of a building. A physical impossibility.

  53. Oh yea, I noticed that. I also noticed the debris field on the street, and the hight and breath of te fassades. It must have been multiple explosion devices, exploded on the inside of the building. But there is not much talk about that, is there? They are still pushing their fertilizer joke…-

  54. I have heard on the news, that the guy they’ve caught said to the police during his interrogation “Yea, I have done it, I shot those kids, but I am not guilty”. What is he saying?

  55. MH says:

    Haven’t you told us that you are blind and can’t see?

    Oh, just one of your many many lies, I see.

  56. I am legaly blind with a vision of 1%. I sit 40 cm away from a monitor with 1,06 meters diameter and I use a electronical screen magnification of 10 X which is included in German Win 7 under the name “Bildschirmlupe”. Thanks for the insult. We do better without you.

  57. MH says:

    BTW – Karlos Hutterer – your insults are legion, remember?

    My intention was not to “insult” you, I was just wondering…

  58. This, ladys and gentlemen, is my place of work. In the middle one sees the oversized monitor. The little monitor on the right, stands on top of a electronic reader for the blind, which magnifies text up to 40 times. That is, what I read my snail mail with and my monthly bank reciepts etc…

    http://carlitos-amsel-vom-holunderstrauch.net/MorphinistenseiteEins/arbeitsweiseterminologie.html

  59. We had a good, intersting and informativ time while you were away, as you can see. To bad your back and spoiling everything again…

  60. You do know that the greatest favore you could do all of us is to go away and spare us all yourself, dont you? So why dont you?

  61. According to the dutch alternativ news site “xander nieuws”, http://xandernieuws.punt.nl/ Oslo police, together with a Norwegian Anti-terror group, held a anti-terror exercise using real explosives that sounded throughout the city while police had “forgotten” to tell the public befor hand, and all this 200 yards away from the site of, and 48 hours before, the real attack. As we all know, this is a strong indication for state false flag terrorism,…-

  62. greenberry says:

    Yes it sure is and the police is now apologizing to the public they never informed the public beforehand about it. So carelessly of them forgetting such obvious thing.

  63. greenberry says:

    “Sorry we forgot about that”. Tyranny and fascism has now reached even the northest parts of Europe. Obviously it seems so in this 9/11 = 7/22 false and disgusting cowarded action.

  64. greenberry says:

    They did also “forgot” to have helicopters and boats at standby for helping the children at Utoya. It took them 1 and 1/2 hour to get there.

  65. greenberry says:

    The pictures taken on the guy in action at Utoya was taken from a media helicopter. They were there long before the police and SWAT team. One can not even believe this is true. But it unfortunately is.

  66. greenberry says:

    This may be worth looking at having in mind it was posted 1 day BEFORE the Oslo bombing.
    http://www.youtube.com/user/TheAlexJonesChannel#p/u/23/MdNlxvkzUf8

  67. greenberry says:

    I almost had chills when looking at the end of the clip where Mr. Jones is describing it exactly as it happened. Maybe not geographically but for sure strategically.
    The truth served on a silver plate?

  68. They are using the same blueprint for every corner of the earth, and why not? In their history, it has shown to be working. Its being said, there was a “communication error” that had the police arrive so late at the Island. At 9. 11 we also had a lot of “communication errors”, remember?
    About an hour ago I heard on the news that they burried the killed children. I heard, they arranged that corner of the cementary in a special way that has to do with butterflies and they are talking about the murdered children as “Butterflies that flew away to early”. I cant say how angry that makes me! How could they do that? Butterflies that flew away to early! That sounds like as if the children died on their own acount, because they chose to do so! They should have called it MURDER CORNER so in a hundred years, people will still know, what this corner is about. But calling it “Butterflies that flew away to early,is an insult to the murder victims! Ten years from now, you’ll have a mom visiting with her teenage child, and maybe mom will still remember what it is all about, but the teenage child wont have a clue, reading something like “The Butterflie Corner” What a treason on the murdered children!!!!

  69. Oh, and it already becomes apparent, what the Oslo attack is being used for. Like Jones said: The chase on “White Terrorists” is on. Everybody who rejects the EU and would rather stick to his own people and his nation state, will now be painted as one of the sort, that perpetratef the Norwegian attacks. The whole political spectrum is curding together into obediant left winger slaves and their slave masters, you know, the “greens”, who want to save the ice bears but ignore US Navy exercises that cause the death of 50.000.000 marin mamals, you know, harebrains like that, the CO2 freaks who, in their ignorance, help the globalist bankers to set up a tax on breathing, while all the rest will be called “Right Wing Extremists”.

  70. darkside says:

    Many people have already come across this information but I’ll repeat it for those that don’t:

    As WW2 ended the C.I.A. moved into the I.G. Farben human research facilities in Frankfurt where scientific experiments were done on prisoners of war and others.

    The Americans inherited something which came to be known as MK-ULTRA supposedly a C.I.A. code name but MK probably just stands for Menschen Kontrolle – ‘people control’.
    The M cannot stand for ‘mind’ as the German word for ‘mind’ is ‘Geist’ – the same word used for ‘spirit’. German does not seem to differentiate between mind and spirit as in the English language. ‘Geisteskrank’ means mentally ill.

    There is plenty of info around on the net as to how the C.I.A. further developed MK-Ultra and sister projects such as ‘Bluebird’ and ‘Monarch’, etc with the aim of managing society.

    After the war researchers who had worked for the Nazis were moved to safe haven and set to work in American universities. The safe passage of the ‘scientist doctors’ was organized through the Vatican and known as ‘Operation Paperclip’.

    In this way Dr. Joseph Mengele who performed experiment young children – especially on twins – was one of many who was not called to account for his violations of the human code of ethics.

    One of many other doctors involved in probing into what makes a person tick, was the Scotsman Dr. Ewan Cameron. His research aimed at erasing the ‘sick’ or disturbed person’s memories and running system and replacing it with a new running program. Like erasing the hard disc and restructuring it for new software.

    It has been learned that when enough stress or pain is exerted onto the mind it has a kind of breakdown and shatters. The theory of Cameron and others was that they could then recreate the person.

    They were particularly interested in controlling soldiers who were unable to carry out certain orders because their conscience of right and wrong got in the way.

    Verify these statements yourself – they may provide the background to the appearance of a generation of robot killers in the world.

  71. I have this information, but what is new to me is the origin of the word MK-Ultra. I have always been disturbed by the MK in it. It made no sense, no matter how you turned it. But now, looking at it as being of German origin, it makes perfect sense.

    It looks as if we have already seen the CIA’s robotic like assassins in action. We might have seen him in JFK’s chauffeur, in the assassination of Robrt Kennedy as Suhan Suhan, in John Lennons killer Chapman, in Reagens John Hinckley and maybe even in Timothey Mc Veigh…

    These were political pawn-robots for delicate work. As for soldiers or secret agents for dirty work, for blunt, straight forward killing, one does not need MK-Ultra, one only needs a selection process to separate the psychopaths from the sane.

    As for victims of the programms developing stage, there are many thousands out there, the CIA has experimented on in order to further their MK Ultra knowledge, Kathy O’Brian, Roseanne Barris, Maryam Ruhullah are only some of them. Many of them dont even know, they have ver been MK-Ultra “experiment material”…- http://www.topsecretwriters.com/2010/10/veteran-mkultra-victims-sue-us-government/

  72. Have a look at this, people. Its worth it:

  73. With the information now coming out of Britains Mordoch scandal, we could roll up the entire criminal enterprise, from political control by jewish criminals to international fractional banking fraud. The only problem will be, that the “Great men and women” who have wriggled themselfs into positions of political power, are perverted pigs who can be blackmailed by the jewish criminal cabbal, that keeps files on them, with nasty secrets in them, nasty fotos and videos of pedophile and other pervert sex practices, of drug consumption, of homosexuality, all them embarrasing things people in power or on their merry way to get there, dont want the public to know. Blackmail, is at the heart of recent efforts to gain world domination.

  74. greenberry says:

    It was arranged as a butterfly corner only to give the murderers behind it a better conscience and feeling better on the surface. It might even give some clue who they were. Burial arrangers = Involved murderers.

  75. I dont think its about “feeling better”. Its more about giving the murderers a cover, since with time, the event will be forgotten and the Butterfy corner will not bring its memory back. Those people dont need anything to give them a good conscience, since they dont have a conscience in the first place…-

  76. greenberry says:

    The greens what they achieved is a waste of time. Another political opposition tool in the hands of the same criminals. Nothing else.
    Unless we dont get to the core or root and have it behind bars nothing will change. Only getting worse and that is with exponential increasing speed. The free fall unto final collapse.
    We must clean the dirt of where it is coming from. An impossible task as long there are no means to clean it with since the justice system is as filthy and apparently does not work at all anymore.

  77. darkside says:

    You wanted to know about the ‘butterflies’ … and the ‘Butterfly Corner’ on Utoya…
    With reference to my last post on the CIA in Europe, the Monarch Program was named after the Monarch butterfly. (The word Monarch is from Greek mono + arch and means ‘single rule’).

  78. MH says:

    Just one question “is spoiling everything again”?

    For heaven’s sake!!

  79. greenberry says:

    Which explains the phenomena of Bilderberg criminal media blackout perfectly. The root
    of all evil, staged and planned incidents happening all around. High time for a clean up? Unfortunately we are in lack of cleaning tools. The justice system is out of order and has been sabotaged by the same guys.

  80. Interesting connection,
    @@@@darkside@@@@

    Thats the way, they are targeting so called “Richt Wing Extremists”, “Nationalists” among us, who would like to keep their country, instead of serving a criminal Eu cabbal, and overseas, in the USA, constitutionalists, Militiamen and -women, gun owners, everybody whos against, thats the root cause of all the strange heart attacks overcoming certain scientists, once they refuse to comply or know to much and are deamed unreliable…

  81. @@@@@qdarkside@@@@@

    I have watched for the last hours the video above. Thats realy something. Its a very deep going, detailed video of the development of all the evil technologies of the last 70 years!

  82. greenberry says:

    Now they have started court proceedings before closed doors. This means that no one in the public is able to know what the fall guy is saying. He is not permitted to read or look at any media. The reason for the closed doors is explained to be for his safety. You know they care so much about peoples safety but when it comes to reality they need 1 and 1/2 hour to show up. When already too late. But they caught the guy hooray.
    Seems they got everything under control and now they can set up whatever lie they want to the public anytime. Since no one else than “special elected” are allowed to hear or know what he says.

  83. greenberry says:

    This is a public crime so the public should demand to be present also in the hearings. What kind of a false and facistic system are we living in? Who are these guys talking about openess and with their doings acting on the contrary. It is so disgusting I need to vomit.

  84. greenberry says:

    And know it is coming out that the fall guys father
    was a diplomat that had been working in the Paris and London norwegian embassies. This reminds me about the underwear bomber in the beginning of 2010 where the fall guy also had a nigerian diplomatic father. He was HELPED onboard the plane WITHOUT a passport by some influental guy according to the witness Mr. Haskell. 2-3 weeks later this incident the TSA received a very costly and large amount of body scanners for use at all U.S. airports.
    A drill is the perfect tool and timing if you need to bring a bomb into a heavily secured area. We have learned that by coincidence such a drill did occur the days before the Oslo bombing in the vicinity of Stoltenbergs office. Roads were closed because of “sewer works”.
    http://www.soulnews.lt/news/norway-terror-attacks-a-false-flag-more-than-one-shooter-on-island-oslo-police-drilled-bomb-blasts-was-it-natos-revenge-for-norways-decision-to-stop-bombing-libya-/

  85. [...] New Greek Bailout Is Bad Deal for Tax Payers, Say German Economists (birdflu666.wordpress.com) [...]

  86. MH says:

    Is this blog Holunderstrauch’s private sitting room ? He is behaving like nuts.
    HE is sitting in the centre bossing everybody about. Nice!
    Most visitors are simply pissed off…

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